“Even explaining it is a mindfuck”: Gavin Leatherwood on twisted thriller ‘It’s What’s Inside’ and challenging himself as an actor
“It’s pretty fucking awesome.” That’s the only way Gavin Leatherwood can describe the journey of It’s What’s Inside, writer and director Greg Jardin’s genre-bending feature debut that shot in less than three weeks in November 2022 before arriving on Netflix on October 4th, 2024.
In between those two points, the movie made waves after premiering at Sundance this past January, a screening that convinced the streaming service to shell out a hefty $17million for the distribution rights. Even though the cast and crew have no say in those numbers, does it make the actor more excited to see how audiences react now that the pressure has been cranked up through no fault of their own?
“Yeah, man,” Leatherwood admitted. “I think above monetary value, while it’s a pretty grand number and an interesting barometer in terms of a temperature check for the movie, I think the greater value is the fact that this was Greg’s vision all the way throughout. He wrote this, directed it, edited it and did the VFX for it, which is a huge undertaking. It’s part of the reason why it took so long.”
Not only did Jardin take on multiple roles during the production, but It’s What’s Inside weaves its way through numerous genres to tell the story of a group of college friends reuniting the night before a wedding, only for a mysterious parlour game to throw the interpersonal relationships into disarray in more ways than one.
“I know it was being edited for a long time because he knew specifically what he wanted,” Leatherwood said of Jardin’s meticulousness. “I don’t know how common it is nowadays to see something that, from start to finish, has little to no interference on the creative side. You’re getting something purely new from this hot new director on the scene, and it’s all him, but I think people are going to love to see the weirdness that is Greg Jardin’s brain.”
In the film, Leatherwood plays Dennis, the latest well-worn example of a character who peaked in college. Alongside Brittany O’Grady’s Shelby, James Morosini’s Cyrus, Nina Bloomgarden’s Maya, Alycia Debnam-Carey’s Nikki, Reina Hardesty’s Brooke, Devon Terrell’s Reuben, and David W Thompson’s Forbes, the central octet get more than they bargained for when celebrating the impending nuptials.
The group gets under each other’s skin both figuratively and literally, plunging them into an evening of body-swapping existential chaos. Eight main characters might seem like a lot, but there are more than eight performances required, something that challenged Leatherwood and the rest of the ensemble every step of the way.
“This was such a special and unique project because we’re all playing each other at different points,” a narrative decision that made a week of rehearsal immensely beneficial. “I think that starts at the top and trickles down,” he continued. “And Greg’s enthusiasm and specificity, but also openness, really fostered this environment where it just felt like a safe place to play and to ask questions.” A challenging experience, but a worthwhile one? “I just loved it,” Leatherwood celebrated. “Man, it was so fun.”
In the opening act, the eight main characters are all presented as archetypes. However, as the story progresses, it becomes clear that’s entirely the point, with Leatherwood revelling in being able to unpack not only Dennis but several of the other protagonists, too.
“Every character archetypically represents some figure of our current culture, and it’s such a relevant and modern movie,” he offered. “I think with everything, you want to find with every character you take on, you want to find as many layers as possible. Obviously, you don’t want to just play the surface-level version of that person. You want to find empathy for everyone that you play.”
“The thing I noticed being the throughline through every character, their common thread was that while they all represent different archetypes, they all are hiding something from themselves,” he mused on one of It’s What’s Inside‘s overarching themes. “Each character has something in their blind spot, outside of their periphery, that they’re unable to address fully. And those are the very reasons; those are the very things that manifest in the story and kind of bite them in the ass through the chaos, and at different moments, their bullshit comes to the surface.”
In the broadest sense, everybody either knows or has met a Dennis. Leatherwood may have never played a character like him before, but it was a challenge he welcomed with open arms. “It was such an intriguing aspect of this film. I was like, ‘Oh, wow’. Exactly what you said. This is so different from anyone I’ve played before, and I wanted to see how far Greg would be willing to go in that direction.”
The star and filmmaker discussed Dennis at length, with Leatherwood suggesting “he’s got the word ‘Forgiven’ tattoed across his chest because he feels that he has the power to have forgiven himself.” Beyond that, pushing himself in new directions as a performer is something he’s hoping to continue doing for a long time to come.
“Actors have their lives and personalities that they’ve come across as their palette from which to create,” he said of his process. “I really want to remain open to all walks of life because I think that there’s something interesting inside every person that we come across. That’s just the business that I’m in, is exploring all these different personalities that are out there so that I can bring characters to light that otherwise would have remained in the dark, and I just want to do it as truthfully and compassionately as possible.”
A lofty ambition, perhaps, but one Leatherwood recognises with the self-deprecating addendum of “not to get too actor-y, or anything.” It’s fitting, though, with ambition one of It’s What’s Inside‘s major creative driving forces. It’s a movie that demands undivided attention from start to finish, and as it turns out, that’s been true since the scripting stage.
“Oh, man, I needed help with this script. Man, it was so confusing,” came Leatherwood’s admirable admission, which is fair enough. After all, the actor’s description of the rehearsal process might sound like it makes little sense at first glance, but it’s a pretty good summation of It’s What’s Inside, with Jardin’s vision making perfect sense when visualised on the screen.
“On paper, I was like, ‘All right, wait. Why is this happening?’ And we read it all together as a cast, once through, as our character would be like in their soul, not in their body, necessarily. Meaning, if I’m in Cyrus, near the end of the script, I would be reading as Cyrus but being Dennis. Even explaining it is a mindfuck. It’s so tricky, dude! But it made sense when we were there. We read it all the way through as, like, where our soul was jumping, and then we read it again as our bodies. It definitely took a few reads and some questions.”
It’ll make perfect sense once It’s What’s Inside has been seen, but trying to lay it out has the potential to make heads explode. The actor’s genre-bending isn’t done by any stretch, incredibly, with the upcoming thriller Fade to Black serving as a spiritual successor of sorts.
Subverting the expectations and norms of a well-worn genre, Andrew Sandler will direct Karan Soni as an aspiring screenwriter who decides the best way to sell his screenplay about a fictional serial killer is to commit the murders himself so that the story instantly becomes an IP-driven film ripped right from current events. Are two challenging parts in quick succession a coincidence or a desire from Leatherwood to continue testing himself as an actor?
“You want a script that speaks to you that you don’t want to put down,” he elaborated. “Selfishly and personally, once that box is checked, I look for, ‘How is this person different from anything else I’ve played?’ And the character in Fade to Black is different than the character I played in It’s What’s Inside, and Sex Lives [of College Girls], and [Chilling Adventures of] Sabrina, and I just want to keep expanding that.”
Leatherwood “welcomes the challenge of playing someone further away from who you naturally are,” even if he isn’t against the idea of taking on something closer to home. “Not that I’m turned off to doing someone who’s close to who I am, but I just have such a fun time playing pretend and setting Gavin aside and being someone completely different.”
What about sci-fi, thrillers, romantic comedies, and grounded, gritty dramas? “I love all that shit,” came the unequivocal answer. “I just want to lend myself to wherever I can be of most use.” Leatherwood has been performing since he was a kid, and during that time, he’s covered film, TV, musicals, theatre, horror, fantasy, sci-fi, and even Shakespeare, but are there any other avenues he wants to explore?
“I want to do this until I’m an old man” is about as committed as responses get. “I really love acting. I think it’s so fun. I love it in any form. Theatre is probably the most adrenaline-pumping version of what we get to do. TV is like a marathon, and movies are like a sprint. There’s also the pathway of producing, writing, directing, and then there’s my love for music and drawing.”
There are plenty of plates to be spun, and Leatherwood has eyes on spinning as many as possible. “All I know is that so long as I am creating and connecting, that I’m in tune with my purpose – which sounds very dramatic, and it is, but I mean it – I’m open to exploring every avenue. Honestly, I just hope that I get to do this for as long as I live because I love it so much, and I love being able to share that with people and maybe make some form of a positive impact on culture or whoever watches it, or I just can bring joy to people. That’s why I do it. It fills me up with joy, and I hope that it brings something like that to the people who watch what I do as well.”
Returning to the crux of It’s What’s Inside, if there was any movie character Leatherwood could embody whether it was to be that person or play their part in a movie, no specific examples came to mind. However, taking on the appearance of somebody nearer the clouds could twist his arm.
“I’ve just said someone whose height starts with a six,” he grinned. “You know, it’s hard for us shorties out here.” His answer was deliberately non-committal and made with a greater point in mind, in fairness, with Leatherwood relating it right back to the heart of his latest movie.
“I think something that this movie really calls attention to is the acceptance and surrender of being you,” he mused. “And while there are moments in my mind where I’m like, ‘God, I wish I could be Ryan Gosling’, I also feel like maybe I don’t. Everyone’s got their own struggles and their own issues, and at the end of the day, I feel like you just want yours. And if you had someone else’s, you’d be like, ‘Oh, fuck this.'”
Leatherwood is “grateful for the life I get to live with all the bullshit included, and I’m willing to stay in this body for this incarnation.” A fascinating philosophical explanation, it was a great deal more introspective than this writer’s suggestion, which was the T-Rex from Jurassic Park.
“Good answer, dude.” Fortunately, Leatherwood approves. “Even with the short little arms, you wouldn’t mind?” Negative, because the lumbering dinosaur doesn’t only survive Steven Spielberg’s original but the entire franchise, which also comes with the additional benefits of being left alone for decades to roam an abandoned theme park and then getting to wreak havoc on any interlopers.
